\doc\web\98\02\innes2.txt


Date sent:        Tue, 27 Jan 1998 21:01:27 -0500
From:             "Richard G. Innes" <70224.434@compuserve.com>
Subject:          RE: Florida repeats WA's test mistakes
To:               "INTERNET:arthurhu@halcyon.com" <arthurhu@halcyon.com>


Arthur,


<<How come Business Week and Ed Week don't write about you, Cunningham, and
your friends?>>


I guess because we have advocacy journalism.  George and I have data and
have reached conclusions that are not politically correct.  


We are getting coverage now, fairly frequently, in the Kentucky papers.  I
even had an Op-Ed printed in the Birmingham News (in Alabama).   


The local paper up here even did a piece on me as an individual.  I only
cooperated because I thought they would refuse to print my letters to the
editor.  


By the way, Ed Week has done a fair job of covering the problems with
KIRIS.  Since I had a small hand in identifying those, you could say I've
had coverage.  I really don't care if I get any personal notice, in any
event.  It is the concepts, ideas, and conclusions that count for the kids,
not who is formulating them.


<<And what the heck is the deal behind this Pritchard
Committee? Seems you've got your own home grown
NCEE taking gobs of corporate money to spread Tucker's
poision.>>


Ah, you are perceptive.  Pritchard *is* the local agent of the foundations,
which are the ultimate funding source for Tucker, too.  I don't think
Pritchard intially started out to become a Tucker tool, but they were
corrupted into this with a long series of grants.  Pritchard gets big
six-digit figures from Pew Charitable Trusts to go out and "tell the good
tale" about Kentucky.


By the way, I would like to hear EVERYTHING you are getting from
Pritchard.  They are very closed-mouth about what they say about
Kentucky out of state.  I can probably give you lots of
counter-arguments.  Be very careful about Pritchard data!


<<Do you have data on how races fare?>>


There is only a little of this out, and I don't remember where I filed it,
because it wasn't very exciting.  Yes, Blacks (using the NCES definition
here, not intending to offend anyone) do not do as well on KIRIS.  We don't
have any other significant minority populations in Kentucky.



<<Do you have minorities complaining yet?>>


Blacks have complained about some aspects of the reform, but not very
actively about KIRIS.  The big complaints are coming from parents of kids
with learning disabilities who all (with virtually no exceptions) must take
KIRIS.  Those discussions have been very heated.  I have commented before
about the fact that LD kids get help on the test, and the science grades
for LD kids were actually higher than regular students on KIRIS.  Still,
overall, parents of LD kids are not happy.


<<...on many of the WA questions, you can only get the
"right" answer by making a guess - in some instances,
you must chose between equally valid or nearly equally
valid answers. There must be cases like this on the
KIRIS test.>>


Bingo.  I just did another short study on the multiple choice examples that
were posted in the Kentucky Department of Education's Web site.  They were
gross, and several didn't have correct answers.  How do you teach kids to
take that kind of test?


By the way, I think I mentioned that it was a multiple choice question that
got me started on education research.  It was the wiring diagram question I
sent you.  It didn't have a correct answer to chose, either.


<<Have you had a chance to compare an actual 4th
grade test against the 4th grade benchmarks?>>


I have not, but others are complaining loudly that KIRIS didn't follow our
new Core Content, which was created specifically to guide the test writers.
 CC isn't a great document, anyway.  I like Virginia's and Colorado's
standards for science MUCH better.


<<WA's benchmarks do not allow conditional probability,
proportionality, rate, or decimal arithmetic, but the
test is strewn with this stuff.>>


KIRIS started this way.  The idea is to create a sense of crisis so the
radical education changes seem warranted.  It is a terrible way to do
things.  Very dishonorable, in my opinion.  By the way, I talked to a
grader from the first year of testing.  She said they were directed to

grade low so there would be room for "growth" in the future.  Like I said,
dishonorable.


Dick  




At least we've only spent $5 million over 2 years on this thing
instead of a billion dollars. Do you have the minority figures then?
Something where I can find out how many standard deviations
down or percentile wise they did?


Date sent:        Tue, 3 Feb 1998 00:46:30 -0500
From:             "Richard G. Innes" <70224.434@compuserve.com>
Subject:          RE: Florida repeats WA's test mistakes

To:               "INTERNET:arthurhu@halcyon.com" <arthurhu@halcyon.com>


Arthur,


<<At least we've only spent $5 million over 2 years on this thing
instead of a billion dollars.>>


I bet your opportunity cost is a lot higher.  How about teacher effort that
has been redirected from good instruction into less productive uses of
class time.  This is hard to quantify, but very real.


<<Do you have the minority figures then?
Something where I can find out how many standard deviations
down or percentile wise they did?>>


I do, but they are buried somewhere.  The differences were noticable, but
not tremendous, and typical for testing with other test products.  KIRIS is
either just as biased as other tests, or the differences in minority
performance are identical.  By the way, Kentucky's only significant
minority group are Blacks (I use the NAEP term here, as that is where the
percentages came from).  They are about 10% of our population.  All other
groups are in the 1 to 2% or less category.


Richard Innes